Unpacking Your Money Mindset

[00:00:00] Christine: Welcome back to the Milspouse Mastermind Show. It is no secret that your mindset holds incredible power. What you think and believe impacts your actions, your attitudes, and your habits. This is true for so many areas. Of our life and today we’re going to be looking at how this Specifically applies to how we handle our money whether you are living paycheck to paycheck or you’ve managed to Accumulate a decent amount of savings in the bank All of us are influenced by our thoughts, beliefs, and our past experiences with money.

[00:00:38] So if you are ready to feel less stressed and make the most of your paycheck, however big or small it is, you are going to love today’s episode. So what do you say? Let’s dive into the show.

[00:01:42] Hey guys, welcome back to the show. I am so excited for today’s conversation because I feel like it’s really timely. I would guess that most of us have felt a little more stress and uncertainty around our finances recently. Yes, Congress passed a continuing resolution with hours to spare. So there was the relief that our spouses are getting a paycheck and some of us are getting a paycheck this month But we don’t know what is going to happen in November So as we are thinking about paychecks and as we are thinking about Money and how we spend money and if we have enough money, I think this is a great time for us to talk about money.

[00:02:28] But this is not your typical conversation about how to budget better as a military family. We are going a level deeper and looking at our money mindset. Have you ever thought about how your beliefs and your past experiences with money influence your decisions? This is your money mindset. Now usually when I hear the term money mindset.

[00:02:54] It’s being used by someone to talk about our beliefs about earning money and what we believe is possible for us and for our future. But the concept more broadly refers to our thoughts and beliefs about money in general and what we do with the money that we have, however big or small that amount is. I know money can be a big issue for military families.

[00:03:23] If one in four families is struggling, then money matters a lot. And there’s not a lot I can do to change the amount that you or your spouse receives. But what I can do is empower you as a military spouse to look at your relationship with money and make the most of what you do have. And so that’s what we are focused on today.

[00:03:50] But before I introduce today’s guest, I want to share a free resource with you. You’re going to hear us talk about the importance of making values aligned decisions. And when I first started hearing people talk about making values aligned goals and decisions and living by your values, I was like, well that’s great, but how do I know what my values actually are?

[00:04:19] So in true Christine fashion, I created a guide to help me figure out what my core values were so that I could make decisions based on that. That worksheet is now available for you to download just by clicking the link in the show notes or going to milspouse mastermind. com slash values. So if you are one of these people that are questioning, how do I know what my values are?

[00:04:48] How do I know what’s most important to you? This is a great place to get started. Now, I know that setting goals and thinking about the future is hard when we’re living paycheck to paycheck and there’s not enough money to go around. But the more that we can look at our habits and feelings and beliefs around money, and the earlier in life that we can do this, the more that we’re able to set ourselves up well for the future.

[00:05:17] So let’s talk about our money mindset. Today, I’m excited to introduce you to a new friend of mine, Jessica Beyer. We chatted briefly about her heart to help military families with money management. And I immediately knew this was a conversation I wanted us to have on the podcast, because she’s not only a financial guru, she actually gets the importance of our mindset.

[00:05:43] Jess is the founder of Habit Money, a finance platform that empowers people to take ownership of their financial futures. Unlike other budgeting and saving apps, it’s a mindfulness journey that helps you overcome the anxiety that comes with money, make values aligned decisions, and achieve your financial goals. Jess, welcome to the Milspouse Mastermind Show.

[00:06:07] Jess: Oh my gosh, Christine, I’m going to hire you to pitch my company because you do a better job than I do. Um, seriously, I’m, I’m so excited to be here and I share a similar sentiment when we first met talking about like the mindset behind money. It’s just, it’s.

[00:06:26] It’s so fun to find people who just kind of get it. Um, so thank you for having me and getting to, to, to share, to share this wisdom and hopefully help some people who listen. Absolutely.

[00:06:37] Christine: So tell me, where did your passion for helping people manage their money come from?

[00:06:44] Jess: Yeah, so I would say it, uh, blossomed late in life.

[00:06:48] I, uh, well, actually I’ll zoom out. I would think about my motivation in two parts. One is kind of my formative childhood and two is where I am today. So When I grew up, I didn’t grow up with a lot of money. My parents were divorcing, which meant there was even less. And I watched my mom really struggle because she didn’t have a lot of financial agency.

[00:07:09] And to this day, she’s still mired down by that. And it was a really big motivating factor for me, whether I realized it at the time or not. That, okay, money is really important. Money equals independence. I really want to be independent. The problem was, I didn’t necessarily have a lot of literacy or education around money.

[00:07:30] So, I spent a lot of my 20s kind of figuring it out for myself. And I was very lucky because I didn’t make any… Super detrimental choices, but I didn’t do the things I should do. And so when I finally got into my thirties and I graduated from grad school with 200 grand in debt, I said to myself, okay, you need, you can need to stop avoiding this.

[00:07:51] Uh, let’s figure it out. And that’s where I realized.

[00:07:58] I realized that even someone like me who’s gone to business school and has access to all of this information really struggles to kind of wrap their head around money and I had a narrative that I was somehow bad at it. And in working with my, working with a financial advisor, I realized it shouldn’t be this hard, but unless you can afford to pay someone to sort of help you, it’s, you just kind of get stuck in this cycle.

[00:08:22] That’s where I decided to kind of explore this problem. You know, there’s so much information there’s so much access out there and yet the average person has a ton of credit card debt and Don’t save as much as they would like to or just constantly beating themselves up because they see their credit card statement and feel bad About themselves, and I just wanted to understand why that cycle was happening when there’s more information out there than there ever was and That’s where I kind of landed on the mindset piece is so much of this is around mindset and a lot of the time we have a hard time making those healthy money choices because of our mindset and the emotions that, that dictate some of our behavior around money.

[00:09:02] And so I thought, okay, is there something I could build that would help bridge that gap so people can overcome those emotions so they can finally start making those healthy decisions?

[00:09:11] Christine: I mean, and this is why I loved connecting with you, because it’s the same with any habit. If it was just information alone that led us to make the good choice with anything, then why haven’t more of us made those good choices?

[00:09:30] But the problem is, we can see that there’s a problem, but unless we feel like we are empowered to make that change, unless we have the tools and resources to actually… makes a different choice, then we stay stuck, and that’s what leads us to feel even worse about ourselves. So we can know that we don’t make great choices with our money, or with our health, or with anything else.

[00:09:56] But it’s really going back to, okay, how do we go from there’s information, but information does not equal effective change? So as you have researched this issue and, and look at this, what are some of the big factors that you see where people really struggle and why they struggle with.

The Behavioral Psychology of Money

[00:10:19] Jess: money? Yeah, yeah.

[00:10:20] There’s, so I’ve gone, uh, I, I will define myself as a burgeoning financial psychology expert because this is so much of what it is. It is behavioral psychology. And you, you said this. Uh, just now about like this kind of cycle of beating yourself up. And so when you feel like you fail, you beat yourself up even more.

[00:10:42] And this is something I want to myth bust, uh, out of the gate. You are wired to be bad with money. We are all wired to be bad with money. Now, some people are quote unquote better than others, but if you think about the way our brains developed when we were early cavemen and women. We would stumble upon a fig tree and we would, if you were someone who is looking for instant gratification, you’d eat the whole fig tree or until you were absolutely full.

[00:11:14] Someone who would abstain instant gratification would say, I’ll have a few figs and then maybe I’ll come back later. But you know what? That person probably died because someone else came along and ate all the figs. So that sort of survival mechanism is the more developed. aspect of our brains, and so oftentimes it takes control.

[00:11:34] And when you think about those things that we sometimes make impulse decisions about, food, money, shopping, you know, whatever it is, it’s that aspect of our, really the emotional part of our brain that is beating the rational brain to the punch. It’s saying, I want this thing that it’s immediately going to make me feel good.

[00:11:56] We are terrible as humans, uh, abstaining from instant gratification. And what is more intangible than saving for the future? You can’t touch it. You can’t feel it. You can’t taste it. And so I just like to kind of say that out the door, because we all kind of have this narrative sometimes that if I’m bad with money, it’s just who I am as a person.

[00:12:19] And It’s who you are as a human, not who you are as a person, but it’s also something to be aware of so then you know, Okay, this is how my brain works. How can I develop tools to sort of slow down that more caveman like part of my brain so that my rational brain can catch up? Because I know I want to make the healthy choice, but sometimes…

[00:12:39] The emotions beat me to it.

[00:12:41] Christine: It’s not a you problem. It’s a human problem. This is something that’s common to being human. And I think it’s, it helps us to have that perspective so that we’re not beating ourselves up like, what’s wrong with me? Well, the fact is, you’re human. We’re all human, and we all have this brain that is telling us, Hey, take it now.

[00:13:06] You want this now. Take advantage of that. And delaying that instant gratification is really hard, and it’s something that we have to learn. I would love to also hear you talk about the role that our environment and how we grew up, how that, uh, plays into all of this.

[00:13:26] Jess: Totally. I mean, so you had asked about the different factors that influence this, and I would say the kind of the, I’ll call it the monkey brain, the caveman brain, that’s sort of this unifying factor.

Environmental & Experiential Factors That Influence Your Money Mindset

The Impact of Your Financial Neighborhood

[00:13:40] But there’s also, I would say, personal factors that impact our relationships with money. So, one is this concept of your financial neighborhood. And so that’s the idea that. The money neighborhood you grew up in really influences how you think about money. And when you move neighborhoods, you’re really, it’s like learning, it’s like moving to a new school or like moving to a new country.

[00:14:09] You sort of have to relearn the rules. And so to make it really tangible, again, I grew up and my parents made less than 25, 000. I graduate from college and I’m making 75, 000 a year in my first job. And I have to decide health insurance. I have to decide retirement. I have to decide how much my rent costs in a city that is not my small town in Montana.

[00:14:34] All of these decisions I have to make in this new financial neighborhood and I am unprepared and ill equipped to make them. And so what happens is oftentimes we default to what we know. Or we shy away from it, because not feeling like we know something makes us feel bad, makes us feel stupid. And if you’re surrounded by people who seem like they know what they’re doing, your tendency is to want to move away.

[00:15:00] And that’s what I did. I just avoided it. I pretended like I knew what I was doing. I made decisions, and I got rid of it as fast as possible. And I can tell you from experience, that is not the healthy thing to do, but that, that is something that happens.

Formative Money Moments: How Childhood Experiences Shape Your View of Money

And then the other piece of it is just your, your formative money moments in your youth.

[00:15:16] Whether your parents talk to you about money or not, you developed your own sort of scripts internally about what money means. So, you know, if you had parents who, you know, a lot of the examples are Some older generations are kind of depression era. And so if you had grandparents who like never threw anything away, that’s a money script and they had it in their heads that you accumulate, you hold on, you save every penny and you never spend.

[00:15:46] And there’s nothing good or bad about that mentality, but that is. That is a script that some people might inherit, and it impacts their money choices. And so, that, that’s another thing that is helpful from a mindset perspective, is to really build awareness, because without realizing it, you might have some emotional triggers.

[00:16:04] that drives some of your, uh, spending behavior, good or bad?

[00:16:09] Christine: Well, I think we, we all have ways that the experiences that we’ve had growing up, what the education that we received or haven’t received, how our parents, like, talking about how watching your mom and how she managed money and how that impacted you.

[00:16:29] But without taking that time to really become aware of that, we just kind of do and act on these ideas, even when we’re not consciously aware of them. So, what was it for you that really made you stop and go, let me become aware of this, this is a problem, something needs to change?

Recognizing Your Current Money Mindset & The Need for Change

[00:16:51] Jess: Yeah, so you’ll laugh at this, but it actually became very clear for me when my partner and I were starting, you know, we were moving in together.

[00:17:00] And so it’s that big moment where you finally have to start talking about money. And it was really hard for both of us, like, like physically uncomfortable. At one point, my boyfriend said, How much money do I need to make so I don’t have to talk to you about money? You know, it was that uncomfortable, and I felt the same.

[00:17:20] The idea of sort of, it felt like you were opening up something so vulnerable and personal. And that’s where we both had this moment and thought, This is weird. What, why we are each other’s person. Why is it this uncomfortable for us to talk about money? And that was kind of that first moment of, of, of having, of realizing that was happening.

[00:17:44] And then also realizing that where it came from was this lack of feeling this lack of power or lack of control. And that’s what I realized I was craving was this, this, I don’t want to deal with my money because I don’t. out of sight, out of mind. I don’t know what’s happening with it. I don’t know if this is something that I feel like a lot of people, I don’t know if there’s something you’ve gone through where you’re just like, I don’t want to deal with it, so I don’t sweep it under the rug.

[00:18:12] And I was like, I don’t, I don’t want to keep feeling this way. I want to feel like I have agency and I want to feel like I know where my money is going and I want to feel, you know, that when I check my credit card statement, I know exactly what’s on it because I, I made a conscious choice. And. I keep going back to this mindset thing, but I’ve also been, you know, experimenting with mindfulness and meditation.

[00:18:37] And I actually kind of got like this click of this parallel of if I spend some time every day just being present, I feel better. And I thought, what if I did something similar with money where I didn’t just avoid it until the end of the month and I’m just present with it and I make it a conscious choice?

[00:18:54] Would that make a difference? It’s

[00:18:56] Christine: funny because when I was going to marry my husband and we were like, okay, we were going to combine our accounts and it was this weird thing of, and again, influenced by how we grew up. Like my dad was an accountant, like I knew how to count every cent to know where all of my spending went, um, to not spend more than I needed to.

[00:19:19] And I was like very particular about, this is how I look at my finances every month. He came into our relationship with like, well, I just kind of there’s money in the bank I’m gonna spend it and and I was like these are two very different habit patterns coming together And and we all have these money stories and then when you come together as a couple like there There’s a lot of conversations that have to be had in order to be able To have a healthy relationship around money.

[00:19:55] And I will tell you from my personal experience, now that we’ve been married for 14 years, we’ve come a long way and we’ve kind of like really balanced each other out. Um, but there were some like very interesting conversations at the beginning, and I want to get back to the, these money mindset, but I would love for you to talk about.

[00:20:18] Money and relationships for a minute and, and what you’ve noticed and observed and experienced about bringing a partner into that relationship and having those

Navigating Money Conversations as a Couple

[00:20:28] Jess: conversations. Yeah, I mean, I just, I so appreciate your vulnerability in sharing this because I think money is such a taboo topic and. I would really love it to become sort of the new mental health where, you know, 10 years ago, no one admitted that they went to a therapist.

[00:20:45] And now I think it’s much more common, still a lot of progress, but I would love for money and talking about money to be that next thing because we make money decisions every single day. And so we often think about big things like. Getting married, buying a house, getting a car, you know, uh, uh, paying for a wedding, whatever it is.

[00:21:07] But tiny little decisions every day, like, are we gonna eat out or are we gonna, you know, eat at home? Are we gonna make coffee at home? Are we gonna go around the corner? Do we get, uh, this kind of detergent or this kind of detergent? What kind of couch do we buy? Where do we go on vacation? It just spirals.

[00:21:25] And so you were living your money values every single day without realizing it. And what you just said, which I thought was so, so cool, is that you came into your relationship with a very clear sense of who, like what your money, money values were. And it sounds like your partner wasn’t as sure, not because he did anything wrong, but you had a really unique situation of where you were kind of taught to do that.

[00:21:50] So I think that’s one of the first things that’s just to be. Aware that people have different money scripts and not to put you on the spot, Christine, but one of the first things that we always talk to people about with partnerships is just kind of putting your cards on the table and sharing where you’re at, just so you can show your partner, like what you do value, what you do prioritize, so you can compare it.

[00:22:13] And I’m wondering, is that something you guys did, like in some of those tough conversations, was part of it being able to, to share? What what the commonalities and the differences were in terms of like how you deal with money and what your

[00:22:27] Christine: relationship is Yeah, we definitely went through premarital counseling which I highly recommend because it forced you to look at all of these issues that Couples get into conflict about and to say, okay, like let’s have these conversations before we choose to go down this path How do you feel about kids and and what does that look like?

[00:22:47] And you know what how much of a priority do you place on your career? And what does that look like and you know Like let’s have the conversation about money and sex and all of these things and I think I was really healthy To have something, a third party, or something that’s not just you and the other person having that conversation, but like, to say, here’s a list of questions we’re gonna go through together, to help get that stuff out there, and into the open, so we can have a dialogue about this.

[00:23:18] Yeah,

[00:23:18] Jess: I love that. I mean, I think, I didn’t realize what I was building was something that was going to gravitate for couples so much, but oftentimes what happens is, uh, the woman in the relationship, not to gender it, but oftentimes it has been coming in and saying, Hey, I’m getting married or we’re planning a wedding and I’m realizing I don’t have a good sense of my money situation.

[00:23:46] And I want to have that conversation with my partner, but I kind of need to figure it out for myself first. And a lot of what we talk about then trickles into the relationship, because like you said, we’re not taught the vocabulary. And it’s not a common thing for us to sort of take a pause and build awareness.

[00:24:04] It sounds like. something that’s simple, but that’s why mindfulness is actually really powerful. And that’s what people do with my product every day is they call it having a money mindfulness moment where something is simple as just pausing and checking in with yourself. Can actually lead to real change like to make an analogy of it when people track their calories like when they’re dieting They will naturally make healthier food choices It doesn’t matter if they break their calorie budget every day because by tracking calories What you do is you’re forcing yourself to pause And make a conscious choice about whether or not you want to eat X thing, uh, based on your goals.

[00:24:48] And that’s the same thing with money, is if you’re pausing and slowing down and saying, Okay, these are, these are my triggers. These are my goals. Knowing these two things about myself, is this thing in front of me something I actually want? Or is it something that… I, my, you know, my, my reactive brain wants and that awareness and that slowing down your brain is what actually leads to those healthier choices.

[00:25:20] And what do we mean by healthy? It means you’re making healthy as in like saving more, spending less, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But what it also means is you’re making choices in align with your goals because how often do you. You know, maybe do a spending splurge and order something on Amazon. And by the time you get the package, you don’t even know what you ordered.

[00:25:40] Those things that we often have impulse purchases for are usually things that don’t make us happy in the long-term, but that awareness and reconnecting with your goals and your values is what actually leads to that true happiness. But you have to train yourself to sort of replace that short term hit with that.

[00:25:59] Long term dopamine hits so you kind of get addicted to the behavior But with a couple now all of a sudden you have like two different value systems and you have to find a way to mesh

How Military Life Impacts Your Finances

[00:26:09] Christine: Those together for sure and you know, it’s even more interesting when it comes to military life because So many of us were never taught how to manage our money and I think more women than men didn’t Especially when, when you look at how that was passed down from generations of knowing how to manage money.

[00:26:34] And then you get into this military marriage, and your spouse might be deployed or they’re gone TDY on a trip or something, and you have to be able to manage the money. Or you’re like, okay, they’re gone. Like, I’m feeling frustrated. I’m feeling lonely. What’s going to make me feel better in this moment?

[00:26:58] And it’s going to Target. And you can’t just go to Target and buy one thing. You, you’re, you come home with a whole cart full of stuff. And, and so to be able to say, there are some Situations in military life that make this even easier to get ourselves into financial trouble because moving is expensive.

[00:27:24] And if you are not budgeting for that move, you can easily spend a lot of money. I mean, I know from personal experience, we go move to this new house, and nothing in that house fits the same way it did in the last house, and the first thing I want to do is go buy all new stuff that’s gonna fit my new house, but if you’re not budgeting for that, you’re just making the, like, I want my house, I want this to feel like home, I’m gonna, like, spend the money, and then…

[00:27:53] Later on you go back and be like, okay, like now we are way over budget and where did what do we need to do to fix this situation? So there’s, I feel like there’s all of the normal factors and then there’s this added layer of the challenges that military life

[00:28:10] Jess: brings. Yeah. I also wonder, Christine, something I’ve particularly wondered about military spouses is this idea of exercising control.

[00:28:22] Like a lot of times what happens from a psychology perspective is when people don’t feel in control of their situation, they make a choice to put themselves back in control. And so I, what my question, I love to know, like what you think of this is something I’ve been thinking about this week is. So much of your life in the military is beyond your control.

[00:28:43] You don’t get to choose where you’re deployed. You don’t get to choose where you move. You probably don’t even get to choose when you move. And so it seems very natural that in that moment, like you said, when you get to your house and stuff doesn’t fit, you just want to be able to exercise some level of agency and say, OK, I’m going to take control here and I’m going to go buy this thing.

[00:29:04] So at least my home can feel like my my. My domain, like does that resonate at all? I

[00:29:09] Christine: think it does. I think there’s really two big elements at play. There’s that sense of everything around me is outside of my control and I want to feel that sense of control, but I think it’s also the element of everything at this moment.

[00:29:26] is uncomfortable and unfamiliar and my mind, my body is craving something that feels familiar. And when I can go give myself, you know, go get that extra Starbucks drink because that’s just going to make me feel like Even though I’m in a brand new city, even though it’s a brand new house, I don’t know anybody, like, I can go there and get a Starbucks and it feels like the Starbucks I had at my last location.

[00:29:53] And, and so that’s comforting to us when we’re in this environment where everything feels

[00:29:59] Jess: unfamiliar. Oh, it’s control. And it’s also comfort. Um, I love that there’s, I keep throwing all of these frameworks out, but this is how I understand these things. It’s a, when, when people are learning, you think of concentric circles and they call it the safe zone, the zone of learning, and then the danger zone.

[00:30:18] And they talk about when you’re trying to, when you’re in growth mindset and you’re learning new things. The goal is to be in that zone of learning because the danger zone is when the good stress becomes bad stress, and then you’re just kind of sort of shutting down. And so what I’m hearing is when there’s, you know, all of these different factors that are sort of driving discomfort, the natural instinct, and I love that you said it’s like my natural instinct is to seek out comfort.

[00:30:45] Christine: For sure, for sure. That it’s a conversation I was just having with my husband this week, just about like, when you move and how much. We are looking for what’s And our brain wants to hold on to that. So, we have all of these things that are keeping us from developing healthy money habits. So let’s talk about what we can do to change the narrative, number one, around our mindset, and develop some healthy habits so that we can actually be in control.

[00:31:20] And make better choices with whatever budget we have, whether it’s a little bit or a lot. Yeah,

Practical Steps to Regain Control of Your Finances (And Reshape Your Money Mindset)

[00:31:28] Jess: I love it. So, I would say first and foremost thing, and we’ve touched on all of these things in a different way, so this is a nice way to package it up, is first thing, Align on what your ultimate goal, your mission, your vision, whatever that is.

[00:31:43] And that might sound very businessy, but whether it’s you or with you and your partner talking about what do we want, what do we want our lives to look like? And it doesn’t need to be, you know, in 30 years we’re doing this. I find planning for 30 years to be very intimidating, but in five years, you know, do we, do we want to own our own home?

[00:32:03] Do we want to be running our own business? Do we want to be out of credit card debt? Whatever that is, like, what is your ultimate goal? Maybe it’s, we want to take Our kids on a vacation for a week every year. It can, it doesn’t have to be something huge, but having something that you’re really, really aligned on together and finding a way to keep that goal top of mind, the reason why, and this is going to sound counterintuitive, but budgeting in and of itself does not work.

[00:32:32] You talk to any finance person and they will say. Every person they’ve tried to just put on a budget doesn’t work. And the reason it doesn’t work is because no one likes being told what to do. And we just talked about control. Budgeting feels like something is controlling you and constraining your choices.

[00:32:49] And that, quite frankly, sucks and doesn’t feel good. But, if you have a clear vision of what you want to accomplish and what your values are with your money, all of a sudden, the choices you’re making with your money, Is not some sort of external person saying, You know what, Christine, you should probably only spend this much on door dash or this much a target.

[00:33:10] It’s you taking your power back and saying, I’m making the choice not to spend on this thing because I want this thing over here and that subtle mindset shift actually makes a really, really big difference. And so you do need to have a budget, but that budget needs to be in service of something that is, it’s bigger.

[00:33:33] Does that make sense? No,

[00:33:35] Christine: I think it’s great because it aligns with so much of what we talk about on the show and especially when it comes to Creating a vision for your life, because none of what you said, other than sometimes buying a house, is dependent on where you live. If you are prioritizing the ability to take a vacation, that can happen regardless of where you live.

[00:33:58] It may have to not happen in the time frame that you want, um, but it is still possible. If you want to get out of credit card debt, you can set a goal for that, and that is not location dependent. So, A lot of what we’re creating when we’re creating this vision for our life is how we want it to look and feel and that can take place anywhere.

[00:34:19] So I love that, and then how that ties into what you have defined as most important to you. And when we start from that place, that is a much more empowering place for us to make. Those decisions and to be able to work towards things that we actually care about and keep that Front of mind because if that is not front of mind, we’re gonna go back to what will make me feel better in the moment Now, I would love to know, one in four military families often struggles with food insecurity.

[00:34:54] And so, when you are in a place where you feel like your finances are out of control because you’re just trying to stay afloat, and it’s not that you need to save to get that vacation, it’s just that you’re just trying to make the budget stretch as far as you can. What can you do in that situation? To feel empowered and to not feel like all of this is out of your control.

Establishing A Long-Term View of Financial Health & Wellness

[00:35:20] Jess: Yeah, I mean one, I, I totally hear that. I, As someone who, when they quit their job to start this company full time, has been feeling this, I think, on a much deeper, empathetic level than I did before, because I’m, I’m, every, every dollar means something to me, and, and so I just want to say, like, I, I hear that situation, and it’s probably really disempowering for, you know, you see these, these people on Instagram who say, oh my gosh, Christine, just stop buying avocado toast.

[00:35:50] You know, so that’s, that’s not helpful. Uh, what, what is helpful is taking an inventory. And so this sounds like a simple thing and it also sounds like something, it might be painful, but it really does help. To just at first to take an inventory of where your money is going. So often people are saying, I don’t understand how my money is disappearing so quickly, taking an inventory and actually figuring that out can be very eyeopening.

[00:36:21] And I cannot tell you, uh, stress enough how often people are surprised by how much they spend on things. And it makes sense because in a vacuum paying, you know, for your latte in that moment makes sense, but then over time. When you look back, you’re like, Oh, my gosh, I can’t believe I’m spending, you know, 8 on this latte versus 4 over here.

[00:36:43] And I hate picking out coffee, but it’s my personal problem. And so I think like just the tracking and the building awareness, it sounds very simple, but it is. So critical because it is not about beating yourself up about what you spend. It’s about gathering data. And if you can take a mindset of just learning instead of judging, taking an inventory can just help you get a sense of where you’re at and You know, if you’re someone who’s trying to stretch every dollar, I’m not sitting here saying, Oh, you’re probably trying, you’re spending too much on coffee and that’s your problem.

[00:37:20] But just knowing where your money is going is a stepping stone because then you can have a real conversation with yourself or with your partner and say, okay, this is how much we have. This is how, what we need to afford. Can we do that? Or do we need to increase our income? That is an okay answer. If you feel like you’re establishing your standard of living.

[00:37:44] The other thing I will say is especially because so often, uh, military spouses and their partners are pretty early in their careers. One of the things to realize is if you aren’t saving a ton right now, that’s okay. But if you’re establishing your standard of living over time, your income is going to increase.

[00:38:05] So taking the time now to be very clear about your money and where it’s going means that every time you increase your income, if you aren’t increasing your expenses at the same rate, you’re going to be able to save more and more and more over time. So just don’t beat yourself up if you’re not saving 50, 000 a year, but if you can get in the habit of saving.

[00:38:29] 5 a day or 15 a week. Compound interest is a real thing. Um, but establishing your standard of living early is great because you talk to some financial advisors who say, I’m getting clients in their fifties and they’re spending me on their means and they haven’t saved for retirement, but they’ve got university tuition to pay for and a second house and a boat and a car.

[00:38:52] And they’ve lived beyond their means for a really long time and never took the time early. To figure out what was truly important to them and what really mattered, uh, in, in the days when they didn’t have as

[00:39:04] Christine: much. I mean, it’s, the earlier that you start, the more this is going to pay off for the rest of your life.

[00:39:13] For all areas of your life. When, when you take that time to say, Hey, what matters to us? What kind of life do we really want to create? And then how do we structure our lives so that we are able to move towards that, even when it feels like we’re not moving the needle very much. And going back to, it’s hard to delay that immediate gratification, but having that vision and really having that awareness of what’s happening, Is so powerful and and that’s what I love about you and what you were doing because I feel like So many people are like, let me give you more information about budgeting about what good financial practices are And to be able to take that information and say, but what does that look like in real life?

[00:40:10] How do I actually change the habit patterns, the thought patterns, my mindset and beliefs around money so that I can actually start to use that information and make those good decisions. So I would love for you to just. Share a little bit about what you’re creating and about how you’re helping people.

Ways to Learn More About Managing Your Money

[00:40:32] Jess: Yeah, yeah. I mean, you again, you pitched it so well, Christine. So I’m definitely just going to save that snippet. So what I’m building is called Habit Money. And if you’re familiar with Noom, what I often say is it’s like Noom for personal finance. So the idea is instead of just telling you what to do, I give you the tools to help you go through the process that we talked through today.

[00:40:55] So build awareness around your money, overcome some of the emotional hurdles, identify your emotional hurdles, overcome them, and then actually see your behavior change so that you would get addicted to that new cycle of behavior. So, as an example, if you were to onboard today, the first thing that we would start doing is Onboarding you into the app and then the first thing you do is you connect your bank accounts and you start daily mindfulness.

[00:41:24] So we’re not even gonna talk about budgeting in the beginning. I’ll tell you what, you set a budget, you’re gonna break it the first month. It’s just how it happens because you don’t, you, you aren’t aware. And so every single day, the goal is not the budget. The goal is the mindfulness in the same way as meditation.

[00:41:40] The goal is to just log in or the goal is just to go to the gym. It’s not to hit some sort of arbitrary number. And then what we do over time is not only do you look at your money, you. Evaluate how you feel about it. So we have a little tinder swipe experience where you can say, like, I feel good or I feel not great and you get that information reported back to you.

[00:42:03] And that’s how we help you identify what your values or your goals might be. So you’ll start saying, Oh, I’ve noticed. That, uh, when I spend on, when I spend on coffees in the afternoon, I don’t feel great about it. But I do feel really good when I’m having a breakfast chat, catch up with my friend. I wonder what that says about what my values are.

[00:42:27] And so that’s, you know, just one example. And then when you start identifying those values, then we’ll go back to, well, what do we want our budget to look like based on our values and the goals for why we’re here? And this is all happening via text. So there’s an app that powers all of this information, but there’s also a human coach on the other side of things.

[00:42:49] And we’re not advisors. We don’t tell you what to do with your money. But what’s so cool about habit is people kind of figure out what they need to do. And we’re just there to help, um, ask questions or to provide you insights. And what is so fun is when I get text messages from our users who say things like.

[00:43:08] Jess, I paid off my credit card bill in full today. Or Jess, I realized that I order online at Amazon at 11 p. m. when I’m stressed about this meeting every Thursday. You know, so it’s, it sounds like such a simple system, but it really does work. And the thing I will caution people on is it’s not a quick fix.

[00:43:30] Oftentimes with dieting or budgeting or exercise or whatever it is, people want to want someone to like, they want to download an app and populate some information and just want to be told like, this is how things are fixed. And unfortunately, behavior change is not something that gets fixed overnight.

[00:43:46] And so you really need to be motivated. And again, that’s why you need that goal. But I also want to acknowledge it’s something that you shouldn’t be expected to do alone. And that’s also like why I built what I built is because I don’t want to be someone who sits here and tells you what to do. I want to be someone who can kind of walk beside you on your new journey as you’re learning until eventually you don’t need help anymore because you’ve, you’ve built up that new habit and it’s just become part of your daily routine.

[00:44:12] Like I would love it if you deleted habit because you didn’t need us anymore. Like that’s a win for me.

[00:44:19] Christine: I mean, it’s just. So much more empowering when we feel like we know what to do and we feel like we’re able to make that then when we feel like somebody’s trying to tell me what I need to do and now I feel bad because I’m not doing it or I don’t want to do what somebody’s telling me to do and there’s a lot of negative feelings coming with that and it’s just So exciting to see a way to make this fun and empowering for people.

[00:44:50] So thank you so much. I’m excited as you are creating this and as you’re getting more people involved, and I really hope this changes our conversation about Money and money habits and really our money mindset. Yeah.

[00:45:05] Jess: Well, thank you for having this platform Christine and for letting me be a part of it. I Obviously, I’m building a business so, you know trying to make a living but the reason I’m doing this is because I really want to solve this problem and I really want to Get this product in the hands of people who need it.

[00:45:22] And this seems like a community that is particularly, uh, because for all of the the dynamics that you shared particularly in need of something like this And so all the more reason why i’m motivated to help so I will pitch, you know, if anyone is interested and is like, Oh my gosh, I want to talk to Jess about that.

[00:45:42] Or I want to learn more, like reach out to me. I’m on LinkedIn, or you can email me at Jessica at your financial habit. com. If you want to try out our product, it’s in beta right now. And I truly mean it. Like, I don’t just send this to my friends and say, Hey, play with this. I actually want to help people.

[00:45:59] So if you’re someone who, you know, either has one of those big goals or just doesn’t like feeling. Not great about their money and wants to be in a healthier mindset. I would love to chat with you and see if I could help.

[00:46:12] Christine: I love it. I will have all of those links in the show notes, so definitely go check that out.

[00:46:18] What I want you to walk away with today is just this idea of awareness. How awareness is the foundation for change. And it’s not something that we need to assign any kind of judgment or blame to, but if we are going to make any kind of lasting change, we first have to become aware of our habits, our feelings, and our thoughts about money.

[00:46:46] Are you aware of the money scripts that you grew up with? Are you aware of your spending habits? Are you aware of your motivations for how you currently manage your money? Again, absolutely no judgment. Just begin by becoming more aware of what you spend, how you spend, and why you spend what you do. I hope that as we move towards the holidays, as we await what happens with government funding and paychecks, and as we live our everyday lives, we will realize that we do have agency, and that we can change our habits and set ourselves up for a life that truly inspires us.

[00:47:36] I would love your feedback on this episode. Just share your thoughts by coming inside our free Facebook community. I have another great interview to share with you next week about how we spend our time. Until then, may you live filled, fueled, and full of joy.